Not an expert but editorializing a summary from a discord server Im on: Prior to 2013, Kendrick Lamar and Drake appear to have a working professional relationship. Drake received early access to...
Exemplary
Not an expert but editorializing a summary from a discord server Im on:
Prior to 2013, Kendrick Lamar and Drake appear to have a working professional relationship. Drake received early access to Kendricks album Section 80 and featured on the followup Good Kid Madd City
"Jermaine Cole, Big K.R.I.T., Wale, Pusha T, Meek Millz, A$AP Rocky, Drake, Big Sean, Jay Electron', Tyler, Mac Miller"
Its been mostly sneak disses (i.e insults with plausible deniability) on both sides since
2015 - Drake has a a separate feud with Meek Millz. Drake is almost universally regarded as the winner
Drake had an arguably related feud with Pusha T. In May 2018, Ts track The Story of Adidon reveals that Drake has a child that he abandoned. Drake is publicly shamed into admitting parentage
Late 2023 Drake feat J Cole release First Person Shooter where Cole defines the "Big Three'" as Drake, Cole and Kendrick.
late March 2024 - Future + Metro + Kendrick release Like That in which Kendrick says something like "Fuck a big three, its big me". Future/Drake also have some history at this point I know little about
Apr 2024 - J Cole releases 7 minute drill, a diss track on Kendrick. After a couple of days, he deletes and publicly apologizes
Apr 19 - Drake release Push Ups a diss track which target Kendrick and others
Apr 19 - Taylor Made Freestyle is leaked by Drake - featuring AI 2pac + AI snoop + Drake
It suggests Kendrick is waiting to respond to Push Ups because Taylor released tortured poets album and doesnt want to hurt her numbers (Kendrick had previously featured on Taylor Swifts hit song Bad Blood)
Taylor Made Freestyle gets copyright struck by 2pac family
Apr 30 - Kendrick releases Euphoria which targets Drake
May 03 - Kendrick releases 6:16 in LA which targets Drake
May 03 - Drake releases Family Matters, targeting Kendrick and others ( weeknd and asap rocky come to mind)
20 minutes after Family Matters, Kendrick release Meet the Grahams, targeting Drake
May 04 - Kendrick releases Not Like Us, targeting Drake
May 05 - Drake releases The Heart part 6 targeting Kendrick in response to Meet the Grahams and Not Like Us
we are here
There are other big players here including Kanye West, Chris Brown and more but Ive tried to keep it simple. Serious (and not so serious) allegations have been cast by both sides. Ill leave it to everyone to draw their own conclusions It will be interesting to see what ends up being truth vs fiction in all of this. Highly recommend a dig into the lyrics, cover art and official posts of each song if this stuff interests you and you want to know more
I appreciate the timeline. That is the "blow by blow", so to speak. However, the content of the "disses" and their motivation are missing. I am not complaining, just clarifying how nebulous it all...
I appreciate the timeline. That is the "blow by blow", so to speak. However, the content of the "disses" and their motivation are missing.
I am not complaining, just clarifying how nebulous it all seems for someone who don't know these artists, is not part of that culture, and is not from the US. Reading a rap lyric doesn't seem to do much for me, I'm afraid. I still have no idea why these two hate each other.
Even reading the Wikipedia this seems to have started randomly.
I’ll try to give some context and motivation for the feud. In 2013 Kendrick was featured on a song Control. In his verse he says the generation before him has their legends solidified but he’s...
I’ll try to give some context and motivation for the feud. In 2013 Kendrick was featured on a song Control. In his verse he says the generation before him has their legends solidified but he’s ready to fight for the number one spot of his generation, and calls out by name some of his peers (including Drake) and says he’s ready to murder them. Most artists took the verse in stride and were happy to be seen as competitors in Kendrick’s eyes. Drake however didn’t appreciate it and mentioned in multiple interviews that he thought the verse was inauthentic and sensationalized. Drake is generally seen as sensitive, so this tracks.
That was more than 10 years ago and in between there have been slight jabs (sneak disses) from both sides and an apparent scrapped interview where Drake goes off about not liking Kendrick.
From what I gather as a fan who’s been keeping up with this for a while, at some point Kendrick’s mild distaste for Drake grew into something stronger. In Kendrick’s direct disses he characterizes Drake as a culture vulture because while he is biracial and has a black father, he was raised by his white mother in a privileged community and lived a privileged lifestyle, but has “code-switched” many times taking on different black accents and cultures as costumes during the last 10 years.
Drake responded taking the feud to a more personal level, saying one of Kendrick’s children is fathered by Kendrick’s best friend, and that Kendrick beats his fiancee. Now the gloves are starting to come off, and Kendrick releases this track within the hour.
Meet the Grahams addresses the fact that Drake has had several suspicious moments involving young women over the years, enough to gain scrutiny from the media. He also works closely with a sex offender, and has even paid a settlement to someone who accused him of sexual assault. Kendrick is throwing this in Drake’s face now calling him a pedophile in the last two songs.
I see. I can certainly empathize with the circumstance of being considered, at once, not black enough and not white enough. Not that this really matters for the discussion at hand. I now have a...
I see. I can certainly empathize with the circumstance of being considered, at once, not black enough and not white enough.
Not that this really matters for the discussion at hand.
I now have a better understanding of the fight, thanks.
The most serious allegation about Kendrick is that he beat his wife, but like, Kendrick has more or less admitted to this in one of his songs and it was presumably rocky time in their relationship...
The most serious allegation about Kendrick is that he beat his wife, but like, Kendrick has more or less admitted to this in one of his songs and it was presumably rocky time in their relationship and they’ve since reconciled. So that’s obviously not good that happened but it’s also just water off a turtle’s back at this point. The rest is just sort of generic like, “you’re short” or “you’re a cuck” type stuff.
Meanwhile Kendrick is accusing Drake of being part of a seedy underground grooming ring within the music industry and also hiding at least one (and maybe many more) illegitimate children that he may or may not have sired on underaged or barely legal girls. THAT’S A BIG DEAL! And a week after PDiddy got busted by the FBI for doing the same no less!
If the conspiracy is as big and as deep as Kendrick seems to hint this is the sort of thing that can end with him meeting the fate of a Boeing whistleblower if he’s not careful.
All that aside, musically this track is really good considering he probably threw it together pretty hastily. Especially that last “You liied” stanza his anger really comes out in his voice. It’s like the aural equivalent of watching Goku go super But it’s all composed and structured so well.
They have dedicated fanbases and have never stopped being involved in the music industry. Chris Brown's career is a pale shadow of what it could have been but Kanye is simply too popular to go...
They have dedicated fanbases and have never stopped being involved in the music industry. Chris Brown's career is a pale shadow of what it could have been but Kanye is simply too popular to go away in short order and his talent for production is still undeniably good even if nobody wants to hear what he has to say.
We might as well have this here. Here's a decent breakdown about this beef and how it got to this unbelievable track that is on a whole other level. On Friday Kendrick Lamar released both Euphoria...
We might as well have this here. Here's a decent breakdown about this beef and how it got to this unbelievable track that is on a whole other level.
On Friday Kendrick Lamar released both Euphoria and 6:16 in LA. Drake responded with Family Matters and within an hour, Kendrick was back with this.
And another one just came out already. This has been truly unbelievable. This isn't just about music anymore, this is deeply personal and it is insane to see a personal hatred playing out so...
And another one just came out already. This has been truly unbelievable. This isn't just about music anymore, this is deeply personal and it is insane to see a personal hatred playing out so publicly.
The music output from this has been jaw-dropping from both sides, and it is still going on. We've had an album's worth of content between these two with some of the most emotionally draining art ever put out.
Just to clarify, euphoria and 6:16 in LA weren't released on the same Friday, but a week apart. EDIT: I'm wrong too lol, idk what I was thinking but euphoria was released on tuesday.
Just to clarify, euphoria and 6:16 in LA weren't released on the same Friday, but a week apart.
EDIT: I'm wrong too lol, idk what I was thinking but euphoria was released on tuesday.
This whole thing is really entertaining for me. Not the music, I haven't listened to any of the diss-tracks. But the memes online about the beef are some of the funniest things I've seen in quite...
This whole thing is really entertaining for me. Not the music, I haven't listened to any of the diss-tracks. But the memes online about the beef are some of the funniest things I've seen in quite some time. /r/blackpeopletwitter is drowning in hilarious shit
Same. I don't mind some Drake and Kendrick, but I don't really listen to a lot of rap and hiphop. But I'll be damned if I'm not lurking r/hiphopheads for explanation, jokes, and memes.
Same. I don't mind some Drake and Kendrick, but I don't really listen to a lot of rap and hiphop. But I'll be damned if I'm not lurking r/hiphopheads for explanation, jokes, and memes.
A security guard at the mansion of Canadian hip-hop artist Drake has been “seriously injured” in a shooting outside the musician’s Toronto home.
The victim, an adult male, was rushed to a Toronto hospital with serious but non-life-threatening injuries following the shooting early on Tuesday morning.
Paul Krawczyk of the city’s police service told reporters on Tuesday that investigators had little information and were studying surveillance footage for leads.
The assailant was reportedly spotted fleeing the area in a vehicle.
Earlier today I spoke with a friend who is firmly on the side of "Drake is a victim here". I walked away feeling conflicted (how fitting...). There's a lot I don't like about the beef. As I said...
Earlier today I spoke with a friend who is firmly on the side of "Drake is a victim here".
I walked away feeling conflicted (how fitting...).
There's a lot I don't like about the beef. As I said above, I've always been a bigger Kendrick fan than a Drake fan, so I've been more inclined to take Kendrick's "side" in this.
But the second Kendrick said, "I think n***** like [Drake] should die // Him and Weinstein should get fucked up in a cell for the rest their life," I did think Kendrick crossed a line. Doubly so when he reminded listeners via the "Not Like Us" cover art that Drake's address is easy to look up.
My friend added an interesting point this morning after news of the shooting broke. He compared Kendrick calling Drake a pedophile to Pizzagate and said violence was inevitable. I agreed that Kendrick had some level of culpability assuming the shooting was beef-oriented.
BUT, as I said above I think it was appropriate for Kendrick to call Drake out for spending too much time around girls and young women. I don't think an artist whose lyrics are as overtly sexual as Drake's and who spends a lot of time talking about sliding into girls' DMs needs to be offering "advice" to girls and young women. The situation gives off major bad vibes and I think it needs to stop.
BUT my friend made another interesting point, which is that despite the bad vibes I'm getting... there are no public accusations against Drake and there's no actual evidence of wrongdoing.
It's all just "this dude/situation gives off bad vibes", and "Kendrick says he's a pedophile".
I think we all agree that violence is wrong. Likely we agree that Kendrick went too far in saying Drake should die.
But what do we think of Kendrick repeatedly calling Drake a pedophile without offering any evidence?
Did he go too far? And is the public going too far in embracing the image of Drake as a "pedophile"?
It'll be interesting to see if legal action is going to be taken. There's a couple of ways in which doing so would be completely justified at this point. The downside is however, that that would...
he reminded listeners via the "Not Like Us" cover art that Drake's address is easy to look up.
It'll be interesting to see if legal action is going to be taken. There's a couple of ways in which doing so would be completely justified at this point.
The downside is however, that that would mean the truth has to come out, which, I wonder how that would turn out for Drake..
Excellent turn of events: Metro Boomin releases a free track for people to rap over, recruits diss tracks from across the world. https://twitter.com/MetroBoomin/status/1787038173501039095
Never thought I'll ever hear saxophone jazz diss track in my life. https://youtu.be/lE2VhEnmCiQ?si=3pF_vo0OnCqnkpgg Edit: Well, metro boomin is getting outed as a metro groomer. :(
Never thought I'll ever hear saxophone jazz diss track in my life.
I am so not the person for this but I guess drake released a response and reception is not good for the infinitesimally small chance your only information on this event is through tildes
I am so not the person for this but I guess drake released a response and reception is not good for the infinitesimally small chance your only information on this event is through tildes
I'm not sure what option he was left with here. Prior to denying the allegations about underage girls, everyone was saying that he wasn't denying it. Now that he's denied it, everyone is saying...
I'm not sure what option he was left with here.
Prior to denying the allegations about underage girls, everyone was saying that he wasn't denying it.
Now that he's denied it, everyone is saying he's playing defense and making fun of him.
I personally enjoy the music of both artists. If there is any merit to the fact that Drake has been inappropriate to young girls, or that Kendrick is a domestic abuser, then I guess that changes the equation. Right now there is a lot of mudslinging based on no actual proof.
Makes for some very solid entertainment though and I genuinely think every song in this battle has been pretty incredible so far. Different people hate Drake for various reasons, most of them unfair, but I think he's held his own. Family matters was great and the fact that the music video shows him crushing the iconic GKMC Van from Kendricks album cover was pretty vicious even though most people haven't really noticed.
I think the best that can be said for Drake at this point is that he can make an argument for being the second best rapper of the 2010s generation. Pushups and Family Matters showcase some of his...
I think he's held his own
I think the best that can be said for Drake at this point is that he can make an argument for being the second best rapper of the 2010s generation. Pushups and Family Matters showcase some of his best rapping in recent years. He really does his best work against the wall.
But putting aside the unsubstantiated claims (e.g. Drake has a second daughter, Kendrick beats his partner), I feel like Kendrick has skewered Drake on the stuff that is verifiable.
Authenticity ("Culture vulture")
As you noted WRT authenticity, Drake often comes off as a poser. I'm not someone to put great store in claims of "cultural appropriation" generally, and I think that criticizing Drake for not being "Black enough" is wrong. BUT, draping oneself in the trappings of hardship while actually being a child of privilege is embarrassing and it's something Drake has been guilty of his whole career.
I definitely believe Drake had a difficult upbringing--but, compared to the awful childhood circumstances of many of his peers in hiphop, he still grew up relatively privileged. (He wasn't gang-affiliated like Kendrick or deep into drug dealing like Pusha T). Naturally his competition is going to be pissed when he tries to claim he "started from the bottom" the same way they did.
Kendrick's done well in the beef to paint Drake as a "master manipulator" who's "Not Like Us". Now, the narrative is that Drake's been stealing stories of adversity from people who are truly at the bottom and using them like slaves (Kendrick's words, not mine...) to build himself up: "How many more fairytale stories 'bout your life 'til we had enough?" That's some brutal character assassination, as you alluded to.
Who's the "hardest MC"
Kendrick has always been more critically acclaimed than Drake. For maybe the first time in his career, however, he's also winning a larger share of the casual audience than Drake. Even though there have been points where Drake's flow was arguably more impressive (the second and third parts of Family Matters are particularly impressive to me), Kendrick's had the catchier bars and the harder hitting lyrics/delivery.
And while I know this has little-to-no relevance in this kind of beef, I also like that Kendrick's resorted to less juvenility than Drake. Makes me roll my eyes every time Drake boasts about his dick size, mocks Kendrick's height, insults the Weeknd for being popular with the gay community, mocks victims of molestation (wtf?), etc. Unfortunately both Kdot and Drake are misogynistic, however.
If this is the end of the beef, I think Kendrick has destroyed any credibility Drake has as "the hardest MC".
J Cole obviously bailed on that weeks ago, though, hahaha.
I haven't followed this much. I just listened to the diss tracks today. When I first heard about it I was kind of surprised Drake would stir somethin up with Kendrick. Drake has never been very...
I haven't followed this much. I just listened to the diss tracks today. When I first heard about it I was kind of surprised Drake would stir somethin up with Kendrick.
Drake has never been very high on my list of artists. I didn't think he was bad but not my style. So I'm surprised to hear anyone thought Drake was a "hard MC." He always came off as kind of as more pop/R&B/rap to me. A guy you'd see at parties/clubs with a large entourage.
On the flip side, I've listened to a lot of Kendrick. He's generally comes off as grounded, aggressive, introspective. His albums containing a lot of autobiographical elements, reflecting on how money and fame impacts his relationships with people he grew up with and how generational trauma keeps its teeth in him.
So while my impression of Drake might not be accurate, this whole thing has gone about the way I expected it. Kendrick has always been able to write searing, pointed criticism usually targeted at himself. Drake (in my estimation) does a lot more "tropey" writing, talking himself up but rarely with depth I think necessary to hold his own in this beef.
I'm seeing a lot of Drake fans saying they never knew Kendrick was this good. I wonder if Drake drank his own koolaid and underestimated Kendrick. But I think what we've seen is a massively successful artist realize that he isn't the artist he thought he was when confronted by an artist who has kept their craft sharp.
I think Drake's early work and his beef with Meek Mill were what gave him what little street cred he had/has. That was when my appreciation for him peaked, especially with Back to Back (what a...
Drake has never been very high on my list of artists. I didn't think he was bad but not my style. So I'm surprised to hear anyone thought Drake was a "hard MC." He always came off as kind of as more pop/R&B/rap to me. A guy you'd see at parties/clubs with a large entourage.
I think Drake's early work and his beef with Meek Mill were what gave him what little street cred he had/has. That was when my appreciation for him peaked, especially with Back to Back (what a time that was to be a Drake fan).
"The hardest MC" is a line from Drake's 2023 song "First Person Shooter (feat. J Cole)", which is what reignited the Kendrick/Drake beef. J Cole raps:
Love when they argue the hardest MC
Is it K-Dot? Is it Aubrey? Or me?
We the big three like we started a league
TBH, I thought the idea of "The Big 3" was laughable the first time I heard it. Like you, I've always been a much bigger fan of Kendrick fan than Drake. I feel both of them have been overrated at times, but Kendrick is a real artist, and that's undeniable imo. J Cole is nothing to me, so I thought it was hilarious that he tried to lump himself in with commercial titan Drake and critical darling Kendrick.
Anyway, I basically agree with you: I felt right from the start that Kendrick would trounce Drake on lyrics.
BUT, what has actually kind of stunned me is that Kendrick has also won over the public. Drake has always been flashier and had more commercial appeal, so I was fully expecting him to win in the court of public opinion. After Mr. Morale (which I loved but which had few bangers) I think I forgot Kendrick was still the guy who put out mAAd city, Backseat Freestyle, DNA, etc.
I think Drake thought the same, and he underestimated how motivated Kendrick was to sink him.
I think winning the public largely comes about due to Drake’s well documented weirdness with Millie Bobbie Brown. That happened when Stranger Things was very hot in the press and particularly...
I think winning the public largely comes about due to Drake’s well documented weirdness with Millie Bobbie Brown. That happened when Stranger Things was very hot in the press and particularly among people who aren’t really tuned into the hip hop scene. But I remember Jezebel ran a story around then that was like “Hey, isn’t it kind of weird that Drake seems to be trying to sidle up to this barely-teenaged girl?”
Not a lot came of it then but since then we’ve had Bill Cosby taken down by Hannibal, the Kevin Spacey revelation, the whole Jeffrey Epstein thing, and recently this documentary about Nickelodeon. And then Sean Combs just got busted. People are way more primed to take this seriously now, so when Kendrick brings up the accusation again and says it’s for real and that Drake is a sick man it’s happening in a context where we now all now know that this sort of stuff goes beyond just being “a little weird and kinda creepy.”
I'm not even a rap/hip hop fan but this was an experience that got me to learn about the history and people around it. And from the outside, any way it goes does not paint Drake in a good light,...
I'm not even a rap/hip hop fan but this was an experience that got me to learn about the history and people around it.
And from the outside, any way it goes does not paint Drake in a good light, especially if we take him at his word on the last song. Because it looks like he's been fishing for drama to hype up a potential rap album. Then JCole stepped out and Kendrick Lamar, who really dislikes him, was not responding.
So if he fabricated all this really vile conspiracy just to air out Kendricks dirty laundry; it doesn't help the image of him being a lieing manipulator or that the idea of being a sex pest is so believable. Like in 6.16 Kendrick implied that he was ready to be exposed but he could sleep easy because it's for the greater good. And Drake was inviting all of it.
Personally, I don't think that it's staged by Drake. Like maybe the secret daughter thing was a plant, he was instantly ready to adress that. But it was just secondary to the crusade against him. I don't think anyone was ready for personalized family letters and an amazing club song calling him a pedophile. Even if it's not true, Drakes son will still hear that and can hold it over him. He'll likely get A Minor, FAN and OVHoe cries for the rest of his life. It'll take considerable brand rehabilitation to close any big deals, let alone signing new artists and he this saga did not net him any new supporters. Also the man at the end of The Heart did not sound to me like he was celebrating a successful long con.
The assault claim killed the respect I developed for Kendrick and I hope it's addressed. But he resented Drake enough to his reputation on the line. But if he was baited into this, the guy would be justified in keeping this up. Drake is not short of flaws and I found Kendrick battle raps from almost a decade ago. He has the ammo and ability make good on the Drake hate album threat. So right now I'm just looking forward to what happens next.
The entire album of Mr. Morale & The Big Steppers, really. He admits to a lot of different things, explicitly and not, throughout the album. Oddly, he says a lot of things that Drake thought he...
The entire album of Mr. Morale & The Big Steppers, really. He admits to a lot of different things, explicitly and not, throughout the album. Oddly, he says a lot of things that Drake thought he was revealing in his disses, and based on Drake's latest response it does not seem like Drake has actually listened to (or, worse, is capable of understanding) the album. Kendrick having marital problems should absolutely not be a surprise to anyone who listened to it. The whole album is about Kendrick using himself as an example of how deep generational trauma goes in the Black community, why there are so many instances of different kinds of abuse in it, and how it results in toxic relationships that poison the children involved.
The domestic violence would be unfortunate if true but it would only be a seriously big problem to Kendrick's reputation if it happened recently i.e. since 2018 or so (the timeframe established in Mr. Morale was that it was five years of "work"), when he's supposed to be a new man who has learned how to be a good partner finally. Kendrick describes himself as a terrible partner who has done many bad things as a partner before that point. This album is basically an exploration of his therapy where part of what he learned is that hiding these sins away or not acknowledging it sets people on a dangerous path of passing it down to the next generation.
For anyone that hasn't heard it, I'd recommend giving it a listen. It's one of the heaviest albums you'll ever here with some of the most shocking and heart-wrenching sequences you'll experience in music. "We Cry Together" is a "song" that I think many people refuse to listen to again after going through it, many have reported that it felt far too real of their own parents growing up.
It was Michael Jackson, not Bill Cosby, and that was years prior to the documentary which seems to have settled the matter on Michael Jackson. It wasn't really a defense of Michael Jackson, that...
It was Michael Jackson, not Bill Cosby, and that was years prior to the documentary which seems to have settled the matter on Michael Jackson. It wasn't really a defense of Michael Jackson, that section was a list of names of famous people who got betrayed in some way.
It's respect—but then tomorrow, put my back against the wall
How many leaders you said you needed then left 'em for dead?
Is it Moses? Is it Huey Newton or Detroit Red?
Is it Martin Luther? JFK? Shooter—you assassin
Is it Jackie? Is it Jesse? Oh, I know it's Michael Jackson—oh
It was still up in the air about whether Michael Jackson really had or had not abused children and many believed it was another trump up case still. He may not have used the name if this song was written after Leaving Neverland came out, and notably Kendrick likened himself more as Prince in opposition of Drake as Michael Jackson (though this may be because Drake is a big Michael Jackson fan) in Like That.
Not an expert but editorializing a summary from a discord server Im on:
Controlin 2013? where he called out a bunch of rappers including Drake. Drake took some offenseThe Story of Adidonreveals that Drake has a child that he abandoned. Drake is publicly shamed into admitting parentageFirst Person Shooterwhere Cole defines the "Big Three'" as Drake, Cole and Kendrick.Like Thatin which Kendrick says something like "Fuck a big three, its big me". Future/Drake also have some history at this point I know little about7 minute drill, a diss track on Kendrick. After a couple of days, he deletes and publicly apologizesPush Upsa diss track which target Kendrick and othersTaylor Made Freestyleis leaked by Drake - featuring AI 2pac + AI snoop + DrakeIt suggests Kendrick is waiting to respond to
Push Upsbecause Taylor released tortured poets album and doesnt want to hurt her numbers (Kendrick had previously featured on Taylor Swifts hit songBad Blood)Taylor Made Freestylegets copyright struck by 2pac familyEuphoriawhich targets Drake6:16 in LAwhich targets DrakeFamily Matters, targeting Kendrick and others ( weeknd and asap rocky come to mind)Meet the Grahams, targeting DrakeNot Like Us, targeting DrakeThe Heart part 6targeting Kendrick in response to Meet the Grahams and Not Like UsThere are other big players here including Kanye West, Chris Brown and more but Ive tried to keep it simple. Serious (and not so serious) allegations have been cast by both sides. Ill leave it to everyone to draw their own conclusions It will be interesting to see what ends up being truth vs fiction in all of this. Highly recommend a dig into the lyrics, cover art and official posts of each song if this stuff interests you and you want to know more
I appreciate the timeline. That is the "blow by blow", so to speak. However, the content of the "disses" and their motivation are missing.
I am not complaining, just clarifying how nebulous it all seems for someone who don't know these artists, is not part of that culture, and is not from the US. Reading a rap lyric doesn't seem to do much for me, I'm afraid. I still have no idea why these two hate each other.
Even reading the Wikipedia this seems to have started randomly.
I’ll try to give some context and motivation for the feud. In 2013 Kendrick was featured on a song Control. In his verse he says the generation before him has their legends solidified but he’s ready to fight for the number one spot of his generation, and calls out by name some of his peers (including Drake) and says he’s ready to murder them. Most artists took the verse in stride and were happy to be seen as competitors in Kendrick’s eyes. Drake however didn’t appreciate it and mentioned in multiple interviews that he thought the verse was inauthentic and sensationalized. Drake is generally seen as sensitive, so this tracks.
That was more than 10 years ago and in between there have been slight jabs (sneak disses) from both sides and an apparent scrapped interview where Drake goes off about not liking Kendrick.
From what I gather as a fan who’s been keeping up with this for a while, at some point Kendrick’s mild distaste for Drake grew into something stronger. In Kendrick’s direct disses he characterizes Drake as a culture vulture because while he is biracial and has a black father, he was raised by his white mother in a privileged community and lived a privileged lifestyle, but has “code-switched” many times taking on different black accents and cultures as costumes during the last 10 years.
Drake responded taking the feud to a more personal level, saying one of Kendrick’s children is fathered by Kendrick’s best friend, and that Kendrick beats his fiancee. Now the gloves are starting to come off, and Kendrick releases this track within the hour.
Meet the Grahams addresses the fact that Drake has had several suspicious moments involving young women over the years, enough to gain scrutiny from the media. He also works closely with a sex offender, and has even paid a settlement to someone who accused him of sexual assault. Kendrick is throwing this in Drake’s face now calling him a pedophile in the last two songs.
I see. I can certainly empathize with the circumstance of being considered, at once, not black enough and not white enough.
Not that this really matters for the discussion at hand.
I now have a better understanding of the fight, thanks.
The most serious allegation about Kendrick is that he beat his wife, but like, Kendrick has more or less admitted to this in one of his songs and it was presumably rocky time in their relationship and they’ve since reconciled. So that’s obviously not good that happened but it’s also just water off a turtle’s back at this point. The rest is just sort of generic like, “you’re short” or “you’re a cuck” type stuff.
Meanwhile Kendrick is accusing Drake of being part of a seedy underground grooming ring within the music industry and also hiding at least one (and maybe many more) illegitimate children that he may or may not have sired on underaged or barely legal girls. THAT’S A BIG DEAL! And a week after PDiddy got busted by the FBI for doing the same no less!
If the conspiracy is as big and as deep as Kendrick seems to hint this is the sort of thing that can end with him meeting the fate of a Boeing whistleblower if he’s not careful.
All that aside, musically this track is really good considering he probably threw it together pretty hastily. Especially that last “You liied” stanza his anger really comes out in his voice. It’s like the aural equivalent of watching Goku go super But it’s all composed and structured so well.
Total side tangent, but how are Kanye and Chris Brown still relevant at all? Is our collective memory that short?
They have dedicated fanbases and have never stopped being involved in the music industry. Chris Brown's career is a pale shadow of what it could have been but Kanye is simply too popular to go away in short order and his talent for production is still undeniably good even if nobody wants to hear what he has to say.
We might as well have this here. Here's a decent breakdown about this beef and how it got to this unbelievable track that is on a whole other level.
On Friday Kendrick Lamar released both Euphoria and 6:16 in LA. Drake responded with Family Matters and within an hour, Kendrick was back with this.
And another one just came out already. This has been truly unbelievable. This isn't just about music anymore, this is deeply personal and it is insane to see a personal hatred playing out so publicly.
The music output from this has been jaw-dropping from both sides, and it is still going on. We've had an album's worth of content between these two with some of the most emotionally draining art ever put out.
Just to clarify, euphoria and 6:16 in LA weren't released on the same Friday, but a week apart.
EDIT: I'm wrong too lol, idk what I was thinking but euphoria was released on tuesday.
Drake is denying that he has a long-lost daughter. It'll be interesting to see if he's lying, if he doesn't know, or if Kendrick is wrong.
Another hidden child might be the least serious allegation in Meet the Grahams but I agree that we should all wait for receipts
A third Kendrick track has entered the ring this week. Not Like US
Fourth. The first one was on Monday. This output is insane.
It is such a banger. I cannot believe the production on these free diss tracks gahdamn.
"Tryna strike a chord, but it's just A minor!"
The band geek in me when I heard that... 🤯
This whole thing is really entertaining for me. Not the music, I haven't listened to any of the diss-tracks. But the memes online about the beef are some of the funniest things I've seen in quite some time. /r/blackpeopletwitter is drowning in hilarious shit
Took a hip hop culture breakdown to get /r/BPT to finally go back to its roots and stop spamming the same 5 political takes over and over again.
Same. I don't mind some Drake and Kendrick, but I don't really listen to a lot of rap and hiphop. But I'll be damned if I'm not lurking r/hiphopheads for explanation, jokes, and memes.
Drake’s security guard ‘seriously injured’ in shooting at Toronto mansion
Earlier today I spoke with a friend who is firmly on the side of "Drake is a victim here".
I walked away feeling conflicted (how fitting...).
There's a lot I don't like about the beef. As I said above, I've always been a bigger Kendrick fan than a Drake fan, so I've been more inclined to take Kendrick's "side" in this.
But the second Kendrick said, "I think n***** like [Drake] should die // Him and Weinstein should get fucked up in a cell for the rest their life," I did think Kendrick crossed a line. Doubly so when he reminded listeners via the "Not Like Us" cover art that Drake's address is easy to look up.
My friend added an interesting point this morning after news of the shooting broke. He compared Kendrick calling Drake a pedophile to Pizzagate and said violence was inevitable. I agreed that Kendrick had some level of culpability assuming the shooting was beef-oriented.
BUT, as I said above I think it was appropriate for Kendrick to call Drake out for spending too much time around girls and young women. I don't think an artist whose lyrics are as overtly sexual as Drake's and who spends a lot of time talking about sliding into girls' DMs needs to be offering "advice" to girls and young women. The situation gives off major bad vibes and I think it needs to stop.
BUT my friend made another interesting point, which is that despite the bad vibes I'm getting... there are no public accusations against Drake and there's no actual evidence of wrongdoing.
It's all just "this dude/situation gives off bad vibes", and "Kendrick says he's a pedophile".
I think we all agree that violence is wrong. Likely we agree that Kendrick went too far in saying Drake should die.
But what do we think of Kendrick repeatedly calling Drake a pedophile without offering any evidence?
Did he go too far? And is the public going too far in embracing the image of Drake as a "pedophile"?
It'll be interesting to see if legal action is going to be taken. There's a couple of ways in which doing so would be completely justified at this point.
The downside is however, that that would mean the truth has to come out, which, I wonder how that would turn out for Drake..
Excellent turn of events: Metro Boomin releases a free track for people to rap over, recruits diss tracks from across the world. https://twitter.com/MetroBoomin/status/1787038173501039095
Never thought I'll ever hear saxophone jazz diss track in my life.
https://youtu.be/lE2VhEnmCiQ?si=3pF_vo0OnCqnkpgg
Edit: Well, metro boomin is getting outed as a metro groomer. :(
that might be my favorite
This is probably most wholesome side effect I heard from all of this.
https://youtu.be/XglDUD7jrdQ?si=vRlbPid1m7x7_Kbw
I am so not the person for this but I guess drake released a response and reception is not good for the infinitesimally small chance your only information on this event is through tildes
I'm not sure what option he was left with here.
Prior to denying the allegations about underage girls, everyone was saying that he wasn't denying it.
Now that he's denied it, everyone is saying he's playing defense and making fun of him.
I personally enjoy the music of both artists. If there is any merit to the fact that Drake has been inappropriate to young girls, or that Kendrick is a domestic abuser, then I guess that changes the equation. Right now there is a lot of mudslinging based on no actual proof.
Makes for some very solid entertainment though and I genuinely think every song in this battle has been pretty incredible so far. Different people hate Drake for various reasons, most of them unfair, but I think he's held his own. Family matters was great and the fact that the music video shows him crushing the iconic GKMC Van from Kendricks album cover was pretty vicious even though most people haven't really noticed.
I think the best that can be said for Drake at this point is that he can make an argument for being the second best rapper of the 2010s generation. Pushups and Family Matters showcase some of his best rapping in recent years. He really does his best work against the wall.
But putting aside the unsubstantiated claims (e.g. Drake has a second daughter, Kendrick beats his partner), I feel like Kendrick has skewered Drake on the stuff that is verifiable.
As you noted WRT authenticity, Drake often comes off as a poser. I'm not someone to put great store in claims of "cultural appropriation" generally, and I think that criticizing Drake for not being "Black enough" is wrong. BUT, draping oneself in the trappings of hardship while actually being a child of privilege is embarrassing and it's something Drake has been guilty of his whole career.
I definitely believe Drake had a difficult upbringing--but, compared to the awful childhood circumstances of many of his peers in hiphop, he still grew up relatively privileged. (He wasn't gang-affiliated like Kendrick or deep into drug dealing like Pusha T). Naturally his competition is going to be pissed when he tries to claim he "started from the bottom" the same way they did.
Kendrick's done well in the beef to paint Drake as a "master manipulator" who's "Not Like Us". Now, the narrative is that Drake's been stealing stories of adversity from people who are truly at the bottom and using them like slaves (Kendrick's words, not mine...) to build himself up: "How many more fairytale stories 'bout your life 'til we had enough?" That's some brutal character assassination, as you alluded to.
He's been getting called out on this for years, nice to see another callout from someone within the hiphop community.
Kendrick has always been more critically acclaimed than Drake. For maybe the first time in his career, however, he's also winning a larger share of the casual audience than Drake. Even though there have been points where Drake's flow was arguably more impressive (the second and third parts of Family Matters are particularly impressive to me), Kendrick's had the catchier bars and the harder hitting lyrics/delivery.
And while I know this has little-to-no relevance in this kind of beef, I also like that Kendrick's resorted to less juvenility than Drake. Makes me roll my eyes every time Drake boasts about his dick size, mocks Kendrick's height, insults the Weeknd for being popular with the gay community, mocks victims of molestation (wtf?), etc. Unfortunately both Kdot and Drake are misogynistic, however.
If this is the end of the beef, I think Kendrick has destroyed any credibility Drake has as "the hardest MC".
J Cole obviously bailed on that weeks ago, though, hahaha.
I haven't followed this much. I just listened to the diss tracks today. When I first heard about it I was kind of surprised Drake would stir somethin up with Kendrick.
Drake has never been very high on my list of artists. I didn't think he was bad but not my style. So I'm surprised to hear anyone thought Drake was a "hard MC." He always came off as kind of as more pop/R&B/rap to me. A guy you'd see at parties/clubs with a large entourage.
On the flip side, I've listened to a lot of Kendrick. He's generally comes off as grounded, aggressive, introspective. His albums containing a lot of autobiographical elements, reflecting on how money and fame impacts his relationships with people he grew up with and how generational trauma keeps its teeth in him.
So while my impression of Drake might not be accurate, this whole thing has gone about the way I expected it. Kendrick has always been able to write searing, pointed criticism usually targeted at himself. Drake (in my estimation) does a lot more "tropey" writing, talking himself up but rarely with depth I think necessary to hold his own in this beef.
I'm seeing a lot of Drake fans saying they never knew Kendrick was this good. I wonder if Drake drank his own koolaid and underestimated Kendrick. But I think what we've seen is a massively successful artist realize that he isn't the artist he thought he was when confronted by an artist who has kept their craft sharp.
I think Drake's early work and his beef with Meek Mill were what gave him what little street cred he had/has. That was when my appreciation for him peaked, especially with Back to Back (what a time that was to be a Drake fan).
"The hardest MC" is a line from Drake's 2023 song "First Person Shooter (feat. J Cole)", which is what reignited the Kendrick/Drake beef. J Cole raps:
TBH, I thought the idea of "The Big 3" was laughable the first time I heard it. Like you, I've always been a much bigger fan of Kendrick fan than Drake. I feel both of them have been overrated at times, but Kendrick is a real artist, and that's undeniable imo. J Cole is nothing to me, so I thought it was hilarious that he tried to lump himself in with commercial titan Drake and critical darling Kendrick.
But apparently the idea of "the big 3" is a real thing?.
Anyway, I basically agree with you: I felt right from the start that Kendrick would trounce Drake on lyrics.
BUT, what has actually kind of stunned me is that Kendrick has also won over the public. Drake has always been flashier and had more commercial appeal, so I was fully expecting him to win in the court of public opinion. After Mr. Morale (which I loved but which had few bangers) I think I forgot Kendrick was still the guy who put out mAAd city, Backseat Freestyle, DNA, etc.
I think Drake thought the same, and he underestimated how motivated Kendrick was to sink him.
I think winning the public largely comes about due to Drake’s well documented weirdness with Millie Bobbie Brown. That happened when Stranger Things was very hot in the press and particularly among people who aren’t really tuned into the hip hop scene. But I remember Jezebel ran a story around then that was like “Hey, isn’t it kind of weird that Drake seems to be trying to sidle up to this barely-teenaged girl?”
Not a lot came of it then but since then we’ve had Bill Cosby taken down by Hannibal, the Kevin Spacey revelation, the whole Jeffrey Epstein thing, and recently this documentary about Nickelodeon. And then Sean Combs just got busted. People are way more primed to take this seriously now, so when Kendrick brings up the accusation again and says it’s for real and that Drake is a sick man it’s happening in a context where we now all now know that this sort of stuff goes beyond just being “a little weird and kinda creepy.”
I'm not even a rap/hip hop fan but this was an experience that got me to learn about the history and people around it.
And from the outside, any way it goes does not paint Drake in a good light, especially if we take him at his word on the last song. Because it looks like he's been fishing for drama to hype up a potential rap album. Then JCole stepped out and Kendrick Lamar, who really dislikes him, was not responding.
So if he fabricated all this really vile conspiracy just to air out Kendricks dirty laundry; it doesn't help the image of him being a lieing manipulator or that the idea of being a sex pest is so believable. Like in 6.16 Kendrick implied that he was ready to be exposed but he could sleep easy because it's for the greater good. And Drake was inviting all of it.
Personally, I don't think that it's staged by Drake. Like maybe the secret daughter thing was a plant, he was instantly ready to adress that. But it was just secondary to the crusade against him. I don't think anyone was ready for personalized family letters and an amazing club song calling him a pedophile. Even if it's not true, Drakes son will still hear that and can hold it over him. He'll likely get A Minor, FAN and OVHoe cries for the rest of his life. It'll take considerable brand rehabilitation to close any big deals, let alone signing new artists and he this saga did not net him any new supporters. Also the man at the end of The Heart did not sound to me like he was celebrating a successful long con.
The assault claim killed the respect I developed for Kendrick and I hope it's addressed. But he resented Drake enough to his reputation on the line. But if he was baited into this, the guy would be justified in keeping this up. Drake is not short of flaws and I found Kendrick battle raps from almost a decade ago. He has the ammo and ability make good on the Drake hate album threat. So right now I'm just looking forward to what happens next.
Didn’t he more or less admit to it in “We Cry Together?”
The entire album of Mr. Morale & The Big Steppers, really. He admits to a lot of different things, explicitly and not, throughout the album. Oddly, he says a lot of things that Drake thought he was revealing in his disses, and based on Drake's latest response it does not seem like Drake has actually listened to (or, worse, is capable of understanding) the album. Kendrick having marital problems should absolutely not be a surprise to anyone who listened to it. The whole album is about Kendrick using himself as an example of how deep generational trauma goes in the Black community, why there are so many instances of different kinds of abuse in it, and how it results in toxic relationships that poison the children involved.
The domestic violence would be unfortunate if true but it would only be a seriously big problem to Kendrick's reputation if it happened recently i.e. since 2018 or so (the timeframe established in Mr. Morale was that it was five years of "work"), when he's supposed to be a new man who has learned how to be a good partner finally. Kendrick describes himself as a terrible partner who has done many bad things as a partner before that point. This album is basically an exploration of his therapy where part of what he learned is that hiding these sins away or not acknowledging it sets people on a dangerous path of passing it down to the next generation.
For anyone that hasn't heard it, I'd recommend giving it a listen. It's one of the heaviest albums you'll ever here with some of the most shocking and heart-wrenching sequences you'll experience in music. "We Cry Together" is a "song" that I think many people refuse to listen to again after going through it, many have reported that it felt far too real of their own parents growing up.
It was Michael Jackson, not Bill Cosby, and that was years prior to the documentary which seems to have settled the matter on Michael Jackson. It wasn't really a defense of Michael Jackson, that section was a list of names of famous people who got betrayed in some way.
It was still up in the air about whether Michael Jackson really had or had not abused children and many believed it was another trump up case still. He may not have used the name if this song was written after Leaving Neverland came out, and notably Kendrick likened himself more as Prince in opposition of Drake as Michael Jackson (though this may be because Drake is a big Michael Jackson fan) in Like That.