Oh man, I can't find the original article, but there was a really interesting piece in either Rock and Ice or Climbing back in the mid 2010s about how high level climbers induce experiences...
Oh man, I can't find the original article, but there was a really interesting piece in either Rock and Ice or Climbing back in the mid 2010s about how high level climbers induce experiences similar to psychedelics. In the article they talk about how your body produces a DMT like product to ease you into death and how sometimes in extreme circumstances your body can respond that way. I think Yvon Chouinard was quoted as saying he would get hyper focus to the point of identifying all friction points (like millimeter scale) on climb when red pointing (he is a bit of a self aggrandizer though so grain of salt). My take away from the article was that we have the receptors for drugs because the body can produce many of those effects itself. I had always chocked those experiences up to the dopamine and mainly adrenaline that you experience during high intensity sports. However this article does make me wonder if it has something to do with the breathing as well. When you're really pushing at your limit, it is very common to push to the point of being short of breath, effectively non-deliberate hyperventilation. It would be interesting to know if this is the phenomenon creating the psychedelic effects on climbers rather than hormones or neurotransmitters. Or maybe they all work together?
Either way great article, and if anyone recognizes the other article from my rambling and has a link to the original I'd love to reread it!
Total noise-comment, but as someone with a healthy fear of heights, I got a good chuckle out of the implication that the body associates rock climbing experience with dying.
how your body produces a DMT like product to ease you into death
Total noise-comment, but as someone with a healthy fear of heights, I got a good chuckle out of the implication that the body associates rock climbing experience with dying.
Ooh nice. This is a topic I've been interested in recently due to my own interest in meditation and the anecdote of a close friend. The friend is very much a hard science kind of guy and very...
Ooh nice. This is a topic I've been interested in recently due to my own interest in meditation and the anecdote of a close friend.
The friend is very much a hard science kind of guy and very strongly atheist. In the 15 years I've known him, I've never heard him describe any experience as even remotely spiritual. That includes mutual experiences we've had with a number of psychedelics.
However, he recently participated in a 45 minute breath work meditation as part of the curriculum for a yoga certification, and he said the experience was genuinely powerful and spiritual.
The experience must've been truly profound for him to choose those words. I've been interested in the meditative possibilities of breath work since.
I think this is fascinating, but I would love to see a follow-up study further supporting their physiological hypothesis by removing the social context of the circular breathwork exercises. The...
I think this is fascinating, but I would love to see a follow-up study further supporting their physiological hypothesis by removing the social context of the circular breathwork exercises. The authors seems to suggest that these could be integral to the effects, but it would be nice if I could do something like this on my own.
I'm also a little surprised that they don't seem to consider oxygen's role in this, or at least that they didn't measure it, since we know that elevated oxygen can have effects on the central nervous system. I don't know if this is an oversight or if they just wanted to put the focus on things like blood pH, but you could do the same experiment but measure O2 levels instead and likely get the same relationships (albeit with correlations reversed).
I would strongly advise against that. The technique is easy and straightforward, but one should experience it at least once or twice in a group setting with an experienced (licensed) facilitator...
but it would be nice if I could do something like this on my own
I would strongly advise against that. The technique is easy and straightforward, but one should experience it at least once or twice in a group setting with an experienced (licensed) facilitator before doing it alone. It's really like with psychedelics: Set and setting matter, and better not go in alone.
It can and will confront you with negative life experiences that you have not fully processed yet. And the reason why you haven't processed them is exactly because you are not in a position to do it on your own without someone present to provide security, grounding and compassion. You will more likely (re)traumatize yourself.
Oh yeah, I don't mean diving into this completely naïve. I would definitely go through the experience with people that know what they are doing several times. I think that's good practice with...
Oh yeah, I don't mean diving into this completely naïve. I would definitely go through the experience with people that know what they are doing several times. I think that's good practice with pretty much any endeavor that involves altering your mental state.
But I like the idea of getting to a point where I can manage the experience on my own when I think it's appropriate. Essentially taking a mental exploration without having to use any sort of drug.
Totally. Every facilitator that I worked with so far shared how during their certification from some point on they felt aware enough of where their boundaries are and what the tradeoffs are to...
But I like the idea of getting to a point where I can manage the experience on my own when I think it's appropriate. Essentially taking a mental exploration without having to use any sort of drug.
Totally. Every facilitator that I worked with so far shared how during their certification from some point on they felt aware enough of where their boundaries are and what the tradeoffs are to continue their breathwork journeys solo -- not as a replacement, but in addition to continuing in groups, since that has some irreplacable benefits.
I would expect that this includes knowing who they'd reach out to for emergency empathy.
Oh man, I can't find the original article, but there was a really interesting piece in either Rock and Ice or Climbing back in the mid 2010s about how high level climbers induce experiences similar to psychedelics. In the article they talk about how your body produces a DMT like product to ease you into death and how sometimes in extreme circumstances your body can respond that way. I think Yvon Chouinard was quoted as saying he would get hyper focus to the point of identifying all friction points (like millimeter scale) on climb when red pointing (he is a bit of a self aggrandizer though so grain of salt). My take away from the article was that we have the receptors for drugs because the body can produce many of those effects itself. I had always chocked those experiences up to the dopamine and mainly adrenaline that you experience during high intensity sports. However this article does make me wonder if it has something to do with the breathing as well. When you're really pushing at your limit, it is very common to push to the point of being short of breath, effectively non-deliberate hyperventilation. It would be interesting to know if this is the phenomenon creating the psychedelic effects on climbers rather than hormones or neurotransmitters. Or maybe they all work together?
Either way great article, and if anyone recognizes the other article from my rambling and has a link to the original I'd love to reread it!
Total noise-comment, but as someone with a healthy fear of heights, I got a good chuckle out of the implication that the body associates rock climbing experience with dying.
Ooh nice. This is a topic I've been interested in recently due to my own interest in meditation and the anecdote of a close friend.
The friend is very much a hard science kind of guy and very strongly atheist. In the 15 years I've known him, I've never heard him describe any experience as even remotely spiritual. That includes mutual experiences we've had with a number of psychedelics.
However, he recently participated in a 45 minute breath work meditation as part of the curriculum for a yoga certification, and he said the experience was genuinely powerful and spiritual.
The experience must've been truly profound for him to choose those words. I've been interested in the meditative possibilities of breath work since.
I think this is fascinating, but I would love to see a follow-up study further supporting their physiological hypothesis by removing the social context of the circular breathwork exercises. The authors seems to suggest that these could be integral to the effects, but it would be nice if I could do something like this on my own.
I'm also a little surprised that they don't seem to consider oxygen's role in this, or at least that they didn't measure it, since we know that elevated oxygen can have effects on the central nervous system. I don't know if this is an oversight or if they just wanted to put the focus on things like blood pH, but you could do the same experiment but measure O2 levels instead and likely get the same relationships (albeit with correlations reversed).
I would strongly advise against that. The technique is easy and straightforward, but one should experience it at least once or twice in a group setting with an experienced (licensed) facilitator before doing it alone. It's really like with psychedelics: Set and setting matter, and better not go in alone.
It can and will confront you with negative life experiences that you have not fully processed yet. And the reason why you haven't processed them is exactly because you are not in a position to do it on your own without someone present to provide security, grounding and compassion. You will more likely (re)traumatize yourself.
Oh yeah, I don't mean diving into this completely naïve. I would definitely go through the experience with people that know what they are doing several times. I think that's good practice with pretty much any endeavor that involves altering your mental state.
But I like the idea of getting to a point where I can manage the experience on my own when I think it's appropriate. Essentially taking a mental exploration without having to use any sort of drug.
Totally. Every facilitator that I worked with so far shared how during their certification from some point on they felt aware enough of where their boundaries are and what the tradeoffs are to continue their breathwork journeys solo -- not as a replacement, but in addition to continuing in groups, since that has some irreplacable benefits.
I would expect that this includes knowing who they'd reach out to for emergency empathy.