18 votes

Tildes Book Club meta discussion - should we read nonfiction as well as fiction and with what frequency?

On the original book nomination thread, a couple of people nominated nonfiction. If we read nonfiction, I want to have a separate voting thread for that category so that everyone can submit books. However, should we? This thread is a chance to vote no for nonfiction and if voting yes to suggest a frequency such as 1 in 3 books, 1 in four books, 1 in six books etc.

If voting yes, please suggest a rate to read nonfiction books in proportion to fiction ones.

Edit , I am counting these as alternative options. Either we read some nonfiction or we don't, so please vote in a way that reflects your honest opinion.

49 comments

  1. boxer_dogs_dance
    Link
    One in five books should be nonfiction

    One in five books should be nonfiction

    19 votes
  2. boxer_dogs_dance
    Link
    No we should not read nonfiction

    No we should not read nonfiction

    11 votes
  3. [8]
    boxer_dogs_dance
    Link
    One in four books should be nonfiction

    One in four books should be nonfiction

    9 votes
    1. [6]
      carsonc
      Link Parent
      Non-fiction always has an "eat your vegetables" feel to me. I always feel that I should do it more than I actually do, yet I never want to. If this group can encourage me to delve into it more,...

      Non-fiction always has an "eat your vegetables" feel to me. I always feel that I should do it more than I actually do, yet I never want to. If this group can encourage me to delve into it more, great. I think a one-to-three ratio is what I can enjoy.

      2 votes
      1. [5]
        boxer_dogs_dance
        Link Parent
        If you want to vote, you should click to upvote one off the ratio comments. I appreciate your comment but I'm only going to count the ratios or the no votes.

        If you want to vote, you should click to upvote one off the ratio comments. I appreciate your comment but I'm only going to count the ratios or the no votes.

        1 vote
        1. [2]
          carsonc
          Link Parent
          I did. I voted and commented, but I can withdraw my comment if that's not helpful. I think this group is great and I'm glad to participate.

          I did. I voted and commented, but I can withdraw my comment if that's not helpful. I think this group is great and I'm glad to participate.

          1 vote
          1. boxer_dogs_dance
            Link Parent
            No, please feel free to comment! : ) Just wanting to be clear for you and for anyone reading.

            No, please feel free to comment! : )

            Just wanting to be clear for you and for anyone reading.

            3 votes
        2. [2]
          public
          Link Parent
          If we find 1 in 4 or 1 in 5 to be fine but feel 1 in 3 is too many, should we vote for both options?

          If we find 1 in 4 or 1 in 5 to be fine but feel 1 in 3 is too many, should we vote for both options?

          1 vote
    2. rosco
      Link Parent
      Depends on the non-fiction but yes, I'd love to jump in with one every now and then!

      Depends on the non-fiction but yes, I'd love to jump in with one every now and then!

  4. rsl12
    Link
    I think that nonfiction would result in more personal discussions, since we are more likely to relate what we read to personal experiences. Tildes discussions from previous (fictional) book club...

    I think that nonfiction would result in more personal discussions, since we are more likely to relate what we read to personal experiences. Tildes discussions from previous (fictional) book club books seem to center on the artistic merits, meanings, symbolisms. I enjoy that kind of discussion too, but I think nonfiction would drive the kinds of discussions that lead to richer interpersonal connections.

    7 votes
    1. [10]
      DefinitelyNotAFae
      Link Parent
      Gonna use this as the chat. I mostly prefer fiction and explicitly SF/Fantasy but I'm struggling to keep up even with the current books. Nonfiction is usually a slower read/less audiobook...

      Gonna use this as the chat. I mostly prefer fiction and explicitly SF/Fantasy but I'm struggling to keep up even with the current books. Nonfiction is usually a slower read/less audiobook friendly. Maybe once I've moved I'll be able to keep up though.

      10 votes
      1. [3]
        boxer_dogs_dance
        Link Parent
        feel free to vote no, but also jump in where you can and don't feel guilty if you can't. Moving is intense and in my experience demands all available time. If a lot of people need more time, we...

        feel free to vote no, but also jump in where you can and don't feel guilty if you can't.
        Moving is intense and in my experience demands all available time.

        If a lot of people need more time, we could switch to a two month interval, but also
        If we are planning four months out, you could focus on book three or four and take your time.

        5 votes
        1. [2]
          DefinitelyNotAFae
          Link Parent
          I'm not overly stressed. I can come back and post later. But I voted for my top two options. (IDK whether that's ok, I'm used to selecting multiple but top choices.) I know you're not counting...

          I'm not overly stressed. I can come back and post later. But I voted for my top two options. (IDK whether that's ok, I'm used to selecting multiple but top choices.)

          I know you're not counting comments was just trying to have a separate convo thread if others also wanted it

          1. boxer_dogs_dance
            Link Parent
            Absolutely! Please always feel welcome but never feel pressured. This is meant to be fun and voluntary.

            Absolutely! Please always feel welcome but never feel pressured. This is meant to be fun and voluntary.

            3 votes
      2. [6]
        lackofaname
        Link Parent
        I can commiserate on the huge time/energy sink that is moving. It's part of why I've been mia from the discussions. Good luck with your move!

        I can commiserate on the huge time/energy sink that is moving. It's part of why I've been mia from the discussions. Good luck with your move!

        1 vote
        1. [5]
          DefinitelyNotAFae
          Link Parent
          I will have two moves, an interim promotion, a permanent promotion, and becoming a caregiver for a newly paraplegic partner who was also hospitalized for 2 months.... In just over a year by the...

          I will have two moves, an interim promotion, a permanent promotion, and becoming a caregiver for a newly paraplegic partner who was also hospitalized for 2 months.... In just over a year by the time the move is finished. So yeah. I need a break

          3 votes
          1. [4]
            lackofaname
            Link Parent
            Ah gotcha, I was initially picturing a physical move. That is a lot, I hope you're able to eke out a little space for yourself soon.

            Ah gotcha, I was initially picturing a physical move. That is a lot, I hope you're able to eke out a little space for yourself soon.

            1 vote
            1. [3]
              DefinitelyNotAFae
              Link Parent
              No no, I meant two physical moves as well as everything. We close on our house on the 30th!

              No no, I meant two physical moves as well as everything. We close on our house on the 30th!

              2 votes
              1. [2]
                lackofaname
                Link Parent
                Ohhh, wow, congrats! That's a lot, but very exciting. though, I have to say, everyone also congratulated me when I bought a house (recently), and remarked how exciting it was. But mostly I felt...

                Ohhh, wow, congrats! That's a lot, but very exciting. though, I have to say, everyone also congratulated me when I bought a house (recently), and remarked how exciting it was. But mostly I felt panic and overwhelm. So, if you do feel excited, amazing. And if you don't (yet), you certainly aren't alone!

                Even now that my nerves are (slightly) calming, I'm nowhere near feeling settled, which I hear is quite normal!

                Just thought I'd share in case you've also been experiencing the roller coaster of emotions.

                2 votes
                1. DefinitelyNotAFae
                  Link Parent
                  Oh I'm definitely in the "oh god why would someone loan me this much money how can I spend this much money" stage. But also "must make wheelchair accessible ASAP"

                  Oh I'm definitely in the "oh god why would someone loan me this much money how can I spend this much money" stage.

                  But also "must make wheelchair accessible ASAP"

                  2 votes
    2. [15]
      Lonan
      Link Parent
      If non-fiction are nominated and voted up sufficiently, then maybe they could be included. I don't think there should be a forced "one in X" quota, nor a blanket ban. There are fiction books...

      If non-fiction are nominated and voted up sufficiently, then maybe they could be included. I don't think there should be a forced "one in X" quota, nor a blanket ban. There are fiction books nominated that I would not want to read, so an interesting non-fiction, eh, who knows.

      9 votes
      1. [14]
        boxer_dogs_dance
        Link Parent
        Interesting perspective. My thought when I saw nonfiction nominated among all the fiction was that it wasn't fair competition because its a different category than most of the nominations. I love...

        Interesting perspective. My thought when I saw nonfiction nominated among all the fiction was that it wasn't fair competition because its a different category than most of the nominations. I love nonfiction as well as fiction and there is a wide range available, although many are too long for a book club.

        1 vote
        1. [9]
          GunnarRunnar
          Link Parent
          So I rarely read nonfiction and I'm not participating in Tildes' book club but I'm agreeing with Lonan here. For a book club isn't the focus on the writing rather than the subject of the book? So...

          So I rarely read nonfiction and I'm not participating in Tildes' book club but I'm agreeing with Lonan here. For a book club isn't the focus on the writing rather than the subject of the book? So if it's an interesting book, it's an interesting book.

          (Off topic: Nonfiction also as a topic provides an interesting topic of discussion in what's true, what's bias and what's just a good tall tale. Obviously contemporary subjects are biased as heck and even historians are known to pick and choose what they believe in. Sometimes a story without much proof is just too good to not include.)

          3 votes
          1. [8]
            boxer_dogs_dance
            Link Parent
            So far the votes are two thirds in favor of reading nonfiction and one third against. If we stick with first past the post voting without considering category, the people who want nonfiction won't...

            So far the votes are two thirds in favor of reading nonfiction and one third against. If we stick with first past the post voting without considering category, the people who want nonfiction won't get to read any in this context. The voting will continue for the next couple of days and we will see how this turns out.

            1 vote
            1. [7]
              DefinitelyNotAFae
              Link Parent
              But recall, I voted for more than one because those were my two preferences. Can't say if that's accurate for others. If that's not what you want, I'd maybe edit the OP to clarify. I can just vote...

              But recall, I voted for more than one because those were my two preferences. Can't say if that's accurate for others. If that's not what you want, I'd maybe edit the OP to clarify. I can just vote once instead.

              (So it's possible the read non-fiction votes are not all unique individuals, and I voted for no and 1 in 5 as either sounded ok. )

              1. [6]
                boxer_dogs_dance
                Link Parent
                It's up to you if you change it. But if you really think both options are ok, am I supposed to parse that as other than two valid votes? I mean the purpose of a voting thread is to choose. I am...

                It's up to you if you change it. But if you really think both options are ok, am I supposed to parse that as other than two valid votes? I mean the purpose of a voting thread is to choose. I am happy with you having two votes if you are truly happy having voted for 1 in 5 and with having your vote counted for that option.

                But I should have clarified in the OP and will do so now. It never fails to surprise me when something I understand is not clear when explained to someone else.

                1. [5]
                  DefinitelyNotAFae
                  Link Parent
                  It's more that assuming the collective total of the "read some" is necessarily meaningful when contrasted with the "read none" may be incorrect! Or I'm the weirdo doing two votes, idk!

                  It's more that assuming the collective total of the "read some" is necessarily meaningful when contrasted with the "read none" may be incorrect! Or I'm the weirdo doing two votes, idk!

                  1. [4]
                    boxer_dogs_dance
                    Link Parent
                    If we go ahead and try to nominate nonfiction books and people aren't enthusiastic, that will become obvious as it did with Cloud Atlas. I don't know how I am supposed to know if people are...

                    If we go ahead and try to nominate nonfiction books and people aren't enthusiastic, that will become obvious as it did with Cloud Atlas.

                    I don't know how I am supposed to know if people are grudgingly going along unless they tell me like you have.

                    I would say you should change your vote to choose one.

                    1. [3]
                      DefinitelyNotAFae
                      Link Parent
                      I can do that. It's not a grudgingly going along though, I'm in this because I'm interested. I'm more consensus build oriented and I didn't vote for anything I couldn't live with if it came down...

                      I can do that. It's not a grudgingly going along though, I'm in this because I'm interested. I'm more consensus build oriented and I didn't vote for anything I couldn't live with if it came down to it. :)

                      1. boxer_dogs_dance
                        Link Parent
                        Thanks for the thoughtful response. I am mulling it over but doing something separately for nonfiction seems like it might work.

                        Thanks for the thoughtful response. I am mulling it over but doing something separately for nonfiction seems like it might work.

                        1 vote
                      2. boxer_dogs_dance
                        Link Parent
                        In that case feel free to leave your vote... It really is up to you, however I am going to count all the votes present. So whatever you want to do. At the end of the day if the experiment isn't a...

                        In that case feel free to leave your vote... It really is up to you, however I am going to count all the votes present. So whatever you want to do.

                        At the end of the day if the experiment isn't a hit it can be discontinued.

        2. [2]
          Lonan
          Link Parent
          Maybe have a length limit for the club? Or take it into account somehow. Even for fiction nobody wants a slog :-)

          Maybe have a length limit for the club? Or take it into account somehow. Even for fiction nobody wants a slog :-)

          3 votes
          1. boxer_dogs_dance
            Link Parent
            Definitely need a length limit. It has to be reasonable to read in 5-6 weeks.

            Definitely need a length limit. It has to be reasonable to read in 5-6 weeks.

            2 votes
        3. [2]
          public
          Link Parent
          I would not treat all nonfiction equally here. If it's a book that "everyone" has heard of, it's safe to assume it's over-padded garbage. Should have been a long essay, but 300 pages were the...

          I love nonfiction as well as fiction and there is a wide range available, although many are too long for a book club.

          I would not treat all nonfiction equally here. If it's a book that "everyone" has heard of, it's safe to assume it's over-padded garbage. Should have been a long essay, but 300 pages were the minimum to consider saleable. This mostly means popular books on psychology or economics.

          However, histories have a much higher batting average over books that try to be about the current real world. It can be an in-depth look at a specific event or a long view of the development of a scientific field; both can produce compelling narratives. I have a whole shelf of 'em I read shortly after I graduated college.

          1. boxer_dogs_dance
            Link Parent
            Nothing will be read without being nominated and voted to the top. Endurance by Lansing is a quality nonfiction book I read recently. I trust this crowd to suggest quality reads

            Nothing will be read without being nominated and voted to the top. Endurance by Lansing is a quality nonfiction book I read recently. I trust this crowd to suggest quality reads

            2 votes
    3. [2]
      gpl
      Link Parent
      I’m chiming in as a non-participant. I read mostly non-fiction and would enjoy reading with others. Maybe it could be something that happens less frequently but concurrently with that months...

      I’m chiming in as a non-participant. I read mostly non-fiction and would enjoy reading with others. Maybe it could be something that happens less frequently but concurrently with that months fiction read.

      3 votes
      1. boxer_dogs_dance
        Link Parent
        Thanks for this idea. Given the feedback this plan makes sense to me.

        Thanks for this idea. Given the feedback this plan makes sense to me.

        1 vote
  5. boxer_dogs_dance
    Link
    One in three books should be nonfiction.

    One in three books should be nonfiction.

    3 votes
  6. joshs
    Link
    I vote no. I think the discussions will be more interesting with fiction. No real world baggage. Non fiction discussions can quickly devolve into one-upping and heated fact-checking. And me...

    I vote no. I think the discussions will be more interesting with fiction. No real world baggage. Non fiction discussions can quickly devolve into one-upping and heated fact-checking.

    And me personally, I mostly read nonfiction so this being for fiction is a good break.

    3 votes
  7. boxer_dogs_dance
    Link
    One in six books should be nonfiction

    One in six books should be nonfiction

    1 vote
  8. [7]
    kwyjibo
    Link
    (Do not vote on this comment, please.) Apologies for hijacking the thread, feel free to label it as off topic, but as someone who'd like to participate in the book club, I'd like the current...

    (Do not vote on this comment, please.)

    Apologies for hijacking the thread, feel free to label it as off topic, but as someone who'd like to participate in the book club, I'd like the current members and its organizer @box_dogs_dance, to consider diversifying the current selection of books. Adding nonfiction books to the rotation is certainly one way of doing that, but currently, all of the fiction selections for the book club is either of a fantasy, or sci-fi genre. (I may be wrong but even the nominated books were all from the same genres.) There's nothing wrong with them of course, and if the club is strictly about these genres, more power to those who participate, but if there's no such limitation, I wish the club would include some classics and other books from variety of genres and perhaps from authors who're not widely known and/or from countries that are generally underrepresented in the literature world.

    1. PnkNBlck71817
      Link Parent
      I don't think the club is strictly about those genres, but it seems those are the genres that the commenters who suggested books mostly read. I would be all for some new genres, but I'm one of...

      I don't think the club is strictly about those genres, but it seems those are the genres that the commenters who suggested books mostly read. I would be all for some new genres, but I'm one of those people that usually read SciFi or Fantasy and have no idea what to suggest otherwise. Please join us in the next round of suggesting books and add in some different genres for us to read (cause I desperately need it but have no idea where to start).

      6 votes
    2. [3]
      boxer_dogs_dance
      Link Parent
      I am considering suggesting themed reads, for example where all authors are a minority or an immigrant, or all nonfiction etc. But to start I want to build enthusiastic participation. People are...

      I am considering suggesting themed reads, for example where all authors are a minority or an immigrant, or all nonfiction etc. But to start I want to build enthusiastic participation. People are voting for what they enjoy.

      Piranesi actually turned out to be a very thoughtful interesting book that was also popular.

      3 votes
      1. [2]
        kwyjibo
        Link Parent
        It's all good. Given the last nomination thread, which I have participated, I think it's clear the club's majority interest differ from mine and more power to them. I'm not close minded about...

        It's all good. Given the last nomination thread, which I have participated, I think it's clear the club's majority interest differ from mine and more power to them. I'm not close minded about fantasy and sci-fi, maybe a book that piques my interest will be nominated in the future and I'd be more than happy to participate.

        If there's enough interest in the suggest themed reads, I'd love to participate in that too. I'll keep an eye out. Thanks!

        1 vote
        1. boxer_dogs_dance
          Link Parent
          Personally I read a wide variety, but especially in a book club that requires people to write rather than talk, I think we need enthusiasm for the chosen books

          Personally I read a wide variety, but especially in a book club that requires people to write rather than talk, I think we need enthusiasm for the chosen books

    3. DefinitelyNotAFae
      Link Parent
      I specifically nominated diverse SFF authors because it's who and what I read and who I wanted to share with others. But all it takes is nominating the books to change the options for what we read.

      I specifically nominated diverse SFF authors because it's who and what I read and who I wanted to share with others. But all it takes is nominating the books to change the options for what we read.

      2 votes
    4. boxer_dogs_dance
      Link Parent
      If I had chosen seven books rather than four, there was an nk jemison book that received seven votes. I have considered themes like minority authors but wanted to get it going first and of course...

      If I had chosen seven books rather than four, there was an nk jemison book that received seven votes.

      I have considered themes like minority authors but wanted to get it going first and of course ask the community.

      Dispossessed at least concerns radical economics

      1 vote